| Search | Memberlist | Forum Register | Profile | Log in to check your private messages | Log in |
  GSKA 2014 Race #13 Registration
2014-10-25 13:00:00 GMT+00:00
  GSKA 2014 Banquet Registration
2014-11-16 19:00:00 GMT+00:00
understanding sprint karts.
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4  Next
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    GSKA Forum Index -> Discussion
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
DigiDAD



Joined: 10 Mar 2014
Posts: 42
Score: 859


PostPosted: Tue Jun 24, 2014 8:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

My son started karting last year at 13. I was not sure if he would like it so we bought a used razor and clone from a club member. He raced and loved it.

We did buy a new chassis as my other son wanted to race too. The older son wound up not being able to race so we now have two razor chassis.

We race one 4 cycle and one 2 cycle. The razor has worked in both classes for us. We may wind up buying a 2-cycle chassis later, but the one thing I have learned in all of this is dont rush into buying equipment. Start slow and see what you like and talk to others.

As far as 2 or 4 cycle they each have advantages and disadvantages. They are both great, but for what it is worth, I might start out with the 4 cycle and then see how it goes. The 4 cycle is less to start. You can get a clone cheap now and the shoe clutch is less too. No starter either.
Stevie and Stacy at Roberts Kart Shop are a tremendous local resource. They have bent over backwards to help and support us.

Once you decide which way you want to go, then slowly acquire equipment. If you keep you eyes open there is always an engine, kart, or clutches for sale at good prices.

Once we got going someone helped us by putting a Yamaha on our kart to see how it went. It went fast.........

David loves his Yamaha now, but it was definitely worth getting some seat time, experience and confidence under his belt in the 4 cycle.

I will tell you that karting has been one of the greatest things I could be doing with my son and I know all of the Dads and Moms feel that way. It is a great safe and fun environment.

I know that I and anyone at the track will lend you a hand to get going.
_________________
George Lawrence
Crew Chief #13 David Lawrence
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Darrin Tebbe
Out to pasture


Joined: 02 Jun 2007
Posts: 1131
Score: 28554
Location: Brooks, GA

PostPosted: Tue Jun 24, 2014 9:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

My suggestion would be to go 4-cycle (especially if that's what you've been running) and I would suggest you sitting out and getting your son going first. You will learn a great deal and get your son off to a much better start that way. Then, once you've got him going (running within .6 or so of the leaders), start thinking about yourself. Starting from scratch with 2 karts will be a lot more like work than fun I can tell you that from first-hand experience.

Stay away from old karts. I don't care which class it is you are not going to be competitive with an old kart. If it's older than 3-4 years make sure you have someone who knows karts give you some good advice on it.

Oh, and if you want a good deal on a fast clone I have one Wink

Seriously, welcome to the club stop by and say hello if you come to the next race. We'll be up by the house under the #14 tent (right next to George).

DT
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
John Wehrheim
Senior 2 Cycle Director


Joined: 18 May 2006
Posts: 2393
Score: 33772
Location: Norcross

PostPosted: Wed Jun 25, 2014 6:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Darrin Tebbe wrote:
Stay away from old karts. I don't care which class it is you are not going to be competitive with an old kart. If it's older than 3-4 years make sure you have someone who knows karts give you some good advice on it. DT


Darrin is right, but it can be done. I race a 2002 Invader in Yamaha Sr. Very Happy
_________________
John
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail AIM Address
fishboy3179



Joined: 19 Jun 2014
Posts: 10
Score: 168


PostPosted: Wed Jun 25, 2014 8:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

i nothing changes our plans we will be there to visit on the 26.

referring to Digidad's comment , whats the difference between a 4cycle or 2 cycle chassis , i thought straight rail was straight rail?

i know son will start first, thats more important.

how about some insight on the frames, i know the razor is a straight rail but it its still favors an lto kart but then you have karts like tony and margay, totally different, and what about the valor. the razor frame keeps coming up but when i spoke with roberts they recommended the valor? what other frames are common at gska, its gonna be a month before i get up there with my own eyes but im super inquisitive right now! also we were so impressed with amp that we are ready to go back.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Xracing36



Joined: 02 Jun 2012
Posts: 112
Score: 1827


PostPosted: Wed Jun 25, 2014 10:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Both 2 cycle and 4 cycle chassis are straight rail. There are a couple minor differences that are more significant at bigger tracks.

4 Cycle Chassis, such as the Razor or Valor, which are very common at this track, vary from full-size 2-cycle chassis in that:

- The wheelbase is shorter
- They run a 30 mm axle, same as dirt karts
- Dirt Kart bodywork is allowed in 4 cycle competition
- Practically straight rail versions of dirt karts, so that they are compatible on road courses.
- Typically, they also have wider wheels

2 Cycle Chassis, such as TonyKart or Arrow or certain Margay models, are a bit different as they have these qualities:

- 50 mm axles
- Longer wheelbase
- Slightly wider as well


The difference is that 2 cycle chassis are meant to handle more speed than 4 cycle chassis, and so they need to be bigger to handle the speed and flex more. Vice versa for 4 cycle, so that they both can be as close as can be to an equal sense in handling between loose and tight.

The Newmans (Chuck and Chris) have TonyKarts, Jeff and Simon Sikes have an FA Kart, which is a different color and sticker kit of a TonyKart, and Daniel White also has a Tony. There is a dealership in Mooresville, NC that deals in FA Karts, along with Arrow Chassis. You can even pay them to assemble the kart for you if you can go out there to pick it up.

When it comes to 4 cycle chassis, it's almost hard to find a 4-stroke kart at Barnesville that ISN'T a razor or a valor. This is not only because they both are good chassis for 4 cycle, but the fact that Stevie and Stacy of Roberts Kart Shop will do almost anything to help get anyone started, and they are less than half an hour away from the track. Great people, and great support.
_________________
Xander Clements, Track Commentator
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
fishboy3179



Joined: 19 Jun 2014
Posts: 10
Score: 168


PostPosted: Wed Jun 25, 2014 10:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Awesome! So what's the general opinion on using a Roberts kart for two cycle? That can be done correct? And at Barnseville and possibly amp do the two types of chassis compete well with each other.likely I won't travel out of state.and what about 4cycle on a two stroke chassis?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Xracing36



Joined: 02 Jun 2012
Posts: 112
Score: 1827


PostPosted: Thu Jun 26, 2014 8:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Using a Yamaha KT100, a popular option in 2 cycle is about as much as I would do with a robertskartshop chassis, and only at Barnesville. Taking it to AMP or any big track will have it bind up, unless you make modifications to it, which I know are possible.

Using a 4 cycle engine on a 2 cycle chassis is also possible, but you may not be able to keep up in the handling department. They are built differently for a reason, and that is to be the best they can be for the engines they are meant to run.

As long as Roberts Kart Shop is around, there will always be a 4 cycle crowd to sell stuff to. So, if you get up to speed in 4 cycle but want to expand or be able to race at AMP, you could always sell your 4 cycle package and be on the lookout for a 2 cycle one. 2 Cycle packages you have to be quite careful about, though, as not only do you get what you pay for, but you don't have such an overwhelming group of drivers on the same chassis as you do with the Razor/Valor team at Barnesville.
_________________
Xander Clements, Track Commentator
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Darrin Tebbe
Out to pasture


Joined: 02 Jun 2007
Posts: 1131
Score: 28554
Location: Brooks, GA

PostPosted: Thu Jun 26, 2014 10:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I can speak from experience as far as Junior Yamaha and Junior 4 Stroke on a standard Razor chassis. My son holds the track records for the following classes at Barnesville, all with the standard Razor:
Animal Sportsman 1
Animal Sportsman 2
Clone Jr 2
Animal Pro Gas Junior
Yamaha Junior
Rotax Junior

At Barnesville in Yamaha junior I don't think there is any disadvantage in running a Junior Yamaha on a Razor. You will need the Euro CIK bodywork to run Yamaha, however.

The disadvantage to a Razor with Yamaha would be at faster tracks with a newer surface that really gets rubbered up and grippy. We struggled to take enough grip out of the razor in those situations. We never could get the kart free and balanced and gave up a lot of time to the european karts (at MMX which is fast and gets rubber down).

With the current kart counts at AMP I doubt that it would ever get that rubbered up (especially with them running concession karts on race day), so the Razor would probably be fine at amp.

But, as a general rule, I would say get a Razor for 4 stroke. Get some sort of all 30mm OTK (Tony Kart, FA, Kosmic) for 2 stroke. The people I respect that are on OTK karts all tell me they are the easiest karts they've ever tuned on, and their results show that.

With Yamaha Senior, I think it would be pushing it for a razor. The extra HP with the pipe and the 7.10 tire on the rear might make it hard to get working. When we briefly had the Rotax on our Razor the 7.10 tire we had to run gave us a push (understeer) once the track got rubbered up. I couldn't to anything to free it up and get it turning and I tried a bunch of stuff.

DT
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
John Wehrheim
Senior 2 Cycle Director


Joined: 18 May 2006
Posts: 2393
Score: 33772
Location: Norcross

PostPosted: Fri Jun 27, 2014 11:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Darrin Tebbe wrote:
Get some sort of all 30mm OTK (Tony Kart, FA, Kosmic) for 2 stroke. The people I respect that are on OTK karts all tell me they are the easiest karts they've ever tuned on, and their results show that. DT


Yes the OTK chassis' are fast out of the box with the basic setup, but there are just as good of chassis out there. Personally I would never buy one. Over priced and everyone has one. In addition, I have driven several and the Brakes suck. I like to buy other proven karts that I know can be fast with a basic setup. Some are Top Kart, Merlin, Energy, PCR, Arrow just to name a few. You just need to buy the right model chassis designed for the tires and HP.
_________________
John
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail AIM Address
Daniel White



Joined: 05 Jun 2007
Posts: 505
Score: 6265
Location: Atlanta

PostPosted: Fri Jun 27, 2014 11:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

John Wehrheim wrote:
Darrin Tebbe wrote:
Get some sort of all 30mm OTK (Tony Kart, FA, Kosmic) for 2 stroke. The people I respect that are on OTK karts all tell me they are the easiest karts they've ever tuned on, and their results show that. DT


Yes the OTK chassis' are fast out of the box with the basic setup, but there are just as good of chassis out there. Personally I would never buy one. Over priced and everyone has one. In addition, I have driven several and the Brakes suck. I like to buy other proven karts that I know can be fast with a basic setup. Some are Top Kart, Merlin, Energy, PCR, Arrow just to name a few. You just need to buy the right model chassis designed for the tires and HP.


For you, an experienced karter who has tuned karts for years, this is valid. But for a new karter, the conventional wisdom says that they should pick up a kart that others race at that track (like OTK karts) and / or one that is supported at the track (Razor)--so they can get help, etc.

If a new karter buys a used OTK kart it won't be so over-priced if they are patient and shop around. Within the past year, Brian Spek and Ihor have offered Tonykart rollers for sale for around $1000-1100.

My brakes don't suck, though I admit that brakes aren't an OTK kart's best quality. I passed at least 8 karts in the two night races, mostly by out-braking them in T1.
_________________
Tonykart EVRR / Adkins Yamaha
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    GSKA Forum Index -> Discussion All times are GMT - 5 Hours
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4  Next
Page 3 of 4

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum

Powered by yyBB © 2008 yycomp. © 2007-2011 YYCOMP